Hello, all!

I'm curious as to know whether building a house that's pretty big is virtually impossible memory-wise in the Sims 3 (with several custom content), resulting in non-stop Error 12 problems, causing me to be unable to work for more than around 20 minutes a session, before the game starts crashing.

Or, so it was on an old computer. I can't really post its specs here because it's not here in front of me now, and it's kind of broken right now, so I'll just post some specs of a new laptop I'm using.

Viewing the DirectX Diagnostic Tool, here are some specifications of the laptop:

System Information:

Operating System: Windows 7 Ultimate 32-bit (6.1, Build 7600)
System Manufacturer: ASUSTeK Computer Inc.
System Model: K43SJ
Processor: Intel(R) Core(TM) i3-2310M CPU @ 2.10GHz (4 CPUs), ~2.1GHz
Memory: 2048MB RAM
DirectX Version: DirectX 11

Display Devices:

Card name: NVIDIA GeForce GT 520M
Manufacturer: NVIDIA
Chip type: GeForce GT 520M
DAC type: Integrated RAMDAC
Display Memory: 1750 MB
Dedicated Memory: 993 MB
Shared Memory: 756 MB

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I have not actually installed Sims 3 on it yet.

The computer which I used Sims 3 on, which ended up having so many Error 12's coming up regularly around 20 minutes after the game session, had the Late Night Expansion and several custom content. I ran Sims 3 on it from an External Hard Drive...a technician told me it would be much slower if I ran it from an external drive than the Hard Drive (Disk C) itself. Is this correct? And if so, could this be the culprit of the Error 12 problems?

People say it's the game's memory that is overloading that causes Error 12. In light of this, I have to admit that the house is...err...ratherbig, to say the least. Bigger than many other houses.

Actually, I plan it to be bigger than probably almost ALL custom-made houses I've ever seen on the net so far.

It uses a lot of custom-made textures created in Create-A-Style, and several custom-downloaded objects, such as the Imperial Emperor chandeliers (great stuff, those ones are!).

If I recall correctly, it actually exceeds 50 Sim squares by width and length, is up to 5 stories high, and has 4 basement stories. It's not yet complete, but if I am able to finish it, it actually might exceed $2 million.

Here are two pictures of its interior (not the final version yet):





Now, basically, here are my questions:

- How will my Sims 3 game run (I plan to install expansions, too), based on the specifications I posted (I know, this is actually more broad than the title...but I just realized it becomes necessary now)? Is it possible to run it smoothly? Will it lag ,etc.?
- Okay, is the reason I can't find almost ANY house that's extremely large (like, almost as large as a 64x64 lot) is because Error 12 puts a LIMIT to how big and complex houses can be?
- Could the fact that I used to run Sims 3 from an External Drive contribute to the cause of my Error 12 problem?

Thank you!

Regards,
Lonious

I'm sorry to say that IMO that laptop is a bit of a lemon

Apart from the 2 GB RAM thing its also using a 32 bit version of Windows, which even if you had more than 4 GB of Ram, would still limit you to 3.2 GB of usable RAM for TS3 at very most. Using 64 bit Windows and more than 4 GB RAM is no magical cure, TS3 is a 32 bit program, so you would still be limited to about 3.6 GB RAM at most, but that little bit extra can come in handy and even sometimes make the difference between unusably crashy and usable with crashes.

Also, seeing as they skimped on the OS and RAM, they probably skimped on the cooling, so you will have to watch that laptop very carefully while playing anything other than minesweeper.

I have 4 GB RAM (of which 3.25 are usable), running Windows 7 32-bit. When it gets to about 1.4 GB of RAM, I save, quit, and reload. Otherwise it either throws an Error 12 or crashes to desktop. Now, your lot looks gorgeous, but also like my own PC would struggle a bit when running it - never mind yours.

Like everyone before me has stated, Error 12 has to do with memory - specifically, running out of it - and translates to:
- the time you spend in Build/Buy and especially CASt (Create a Style);
- the length of your play session. The longer you play, the more memory gets taken up;
- the amount of game content you have - this includes both official (EPs, SPs, Store) and custom content.

A lot's playability (including loading time and performance during playing) depends on several factors, including:
- the size of the lot and how much of it is occupied by objects (a 64x64 lot with a house that takes up 50x50 will lag significantly more than a 25x25 one);
- the number of objects (of any kind) placed on it;
- the number of spawners placed on it. Remember, the game needs to calculate when to (re)spawn certain items such as bugs and seeds, which equals more strain on your computer when the spawners have to reload;
- the number of special effects you use, which includes lights are fog emitters;
- the number of high-poly items your lot contains.

What you can do to avoid Error 12:
- in your Mods folder, keep only CC you actually play with. Keep everything else in a folder somewhere else on your hard drive;
- merge your .package files;
- turn off Data Execution Prevention;
- close any programs you don't need when playing TS3;
- avoid high-poly content. The stuff is a trial even for good computers;
- limit your play sessions. Save your lot after every major change. Keep Task Manager running all the time and monitor TS3; when it starts taking up too much memory, save, quit, and reload;
- try building your lot in a completely empty world, then moving it to the world you want to play in;
- use Kuree's Save Cleaner to clean your save file once in a while.


Wait, does this mean TCE needs to be turned off? I have it on all the time...

Honestly, that's news to me. I have TCE on by default with Overwatch, and have never found anything detrimental or evidence of excessive memory use when it's "on". Even tried turning it off manually and played for 2 sim days (I know, not a definitive test by any means) and didn't notice anything unusual in memory usage.



I'll occasionally get that during a build session but never found it correlating with much, although the F5 trick works most times. I do have a particular problem when building fences and adding gates where build mode will freeze, but I can usually get out with F1 and then reenter to continue the build. Same thing occurs on occasion when building pools and adding pool accessories. No clue why, and not a 'fatal" error as long as I can get back out. As at least it's salvageable, so I've just learned to accept it and no longer freak out after an hour and a half into a build and forgot to save yet.

I run into this even without spending a lot of time in Build/Buy/CASt BUT after having switched several times between the three, for a short time (e.g. adding a chair in Buy, then moving to Build to recolor it, then adding a table etc.). What I usually get is part of the UI being black, buttons may or may not be included. When this happens...I don't remember ever being able to save the game. It's either Error 12 or CTD at that point. Lots are medium-sized (at most 30x30), not heavily decorated, but they DO have several CASt-applied patterns (it isn't restricted to a single pattern, it does this regardless of which I choose).

Recently I've had a glitch with random things where if I try to pick them up the cursor will switch to the hand/starry wheel and stay like that, making me unable to click on anything. Again, I have to use the keyboard (F5) to access the menu and return the cursor to normal. The odd thing is that the first time it happened, the offender was a random harvestable; recently, I've been having this issue with an imaginary friend doll (which I ended up deleting since all IFs are buggy in one way or another for me).

I'll go and test turning TCE off and report back.

Very interesting point about TCE nitro. I have no solid data on anything, so take everything I say in this post with a grain of salt. I have two computers I generally play in, one of them is a LOT worse than the other when comes to crashes and save errors. On that particular computer, I have always been very cautious about using TCE. It's always been a bit like playing with fire. I noticed that my game would consistently crash if I ever tried to play for any extent of time with TCE on. I always turn it on, then turn it off immediately when I'm done. If I ever forgot to turn it off for too long, the game would invariably crash before I got a chance to save. My game is crashy enough as it is, but even knowing that I was convinced TCE was making it worse. Could be coincidental... but now I'm not so sure. For computers that are prone to crashing and errors or worlds that use a lot of memory, leaving TCE on definitely seems to be a bad idea.

OTOH, after years of playing this glitchy mess of a game, recently I kinda feel like I've "beaten" Error Code 12. I haven't had a game lost to that Error in over a year, I think... Crashes and Freezes while saving are still a major pain, but not EC12. One simple trick has saved me a lot of grief. Usually, I think what causes the game so many problems is the active lot itself. This is seems to where most of the objects taking up memory are, this is generally where all the active sims are, etc. The game runs out of memory and can't save when simply playing the game for a period of time builds up the demand for memory too much. What I've found to work 90% of the time, with some persistence, is simply zooming out of the active lot, and zooming in on an empty barren portion on the edge of the world. Sometimes pressing 'm' and zooming out to map mode is enough to get rid of the error. But almost every time I try this trick the game eventually saves. Maybe not the first time. But if I do 'Save As' and try again, it might save the second time. Again, there is a chance this will NOT work. Sometimes, no matter how many times I try, this doesn't work and the game eventually crashes or freezes while trying to save. But I file that as a loss to a crash or a freeze, not EC12

So you might think 'Okay, it saves. But you're still screwed whenever you open up the game again, because the same error is still there. The same problem when you Travel to another world and save would happen here, right"? Nope! The next time I've loaded up the game, I've had absolutely no problems saving normally while on the home lot. For whatever reason, the memory problem that the main lot was producing in the earlier instance isn't necessarily something that the game cannot process. It's just something that it can't handle at the moment when it has all the extraneous junk that normal play sessions produce.
This trick + "ResetSim *" are the only ways I've been able to play in IP or play any of my more advanced legacies on my glitchier computer without losing my sanity.

How are you building your lot, OP? (it looks incredible btw). If you're doing it from Build/Buy Mode and not Edit Town, (which would probably be a lot more stable anyway? I'm not a builder though, so I don't know.) you could try this trick. Leave the lot, go to some barren empty patch and see if the game takes your edits this time. I'm interested to see if anyone else has as much success using this as I have...

As much as I like finding new ways of getting out of trouble due to the game's piss poor memory management, the truth is the best protection I've found is to stick with sequentially numbered Save As.............., typically one each sim day, or after a major milestone. Then if an Error 12 doesn't yield to the usual contortions, not much is really lost in stepping back by one save. That, and keeping a single game session to 3 hours or less.