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Mad Poster
#501 Old 1st Mar 2009 at 6:53 PM
Quote: Originally posted by yinakori
How much time you spend considering the other side doesn't relate to whether or not you are atheist. On the flip side, would a religious person who spends time refuting scientific principles suddenly be called an atheist in denial? You claim that people are guilty by association, but that omits too many factors. For one, many of the atheist books were written in response to what the religious first considered and refused about atheism.

Constant proof is what makes people true free thinkers; without evidence, you could not form an adequate opinion on something. So when an athiest puts forth the effort into refusing religion and does a rational job of it, why shouldn't it be published? It's impossible for atheism and religion to coexist if atheists don't even acknowledge religion, because atheism was made by denying religion's base: the existence of a god. I don't doubt that some people go to seminars for that purpose, but try not to over-generalize it. Being well-informed in your own belief/disbelief is a good thing, both for the religious and the non-religious.



Well, I don't see what is there to publish. God is a concept, it exists, scientifically, only in people's mind. I think it's pretty pointless to try to prove wrong or inexistent something you know is made up and that even believers can't prove true in a scientific way. Sure, there was the prophet and the bible is somewhat of a history book, but can they prove the existance or inexistance of god based on that? No, they can only theorize about it, search the historic sites for proofs of happenings described in the bible, but they cannot prove inexistance of god based on that, because god of a particular religion exists only as long as there is faith in that particular religion.
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Test Subject
#502 Old 1st Mar 2009 at 7:54 PM
Quote: Originally posted by crocobaura
Well, I don't see what is there to publish. God is a concept, it exists, scientifically, only in people's mind. I think it's pretty pointless to try to prove wrong or inexistent something you know is made up and that even believers can't prove true in a scientific way. Sure, there was the prophet and the bible is somewhat of a history book, but can they prove the existance or inexistance of god based on that? No, they can only theorize about it, search the historic sites for proofs of happenings described in the bible, but they cannot prove inexistance of god based on that, because god of a particular religion exists only as long as there is faith in that particular religion.

Well, we do agree on something. I don't see what there is to publish either. But the point is, people do argue about this, and people do insult other people based on their religion (or lack thereof). If religious discussions were only strictly on a non-conversion basis, there wouldn't be a need for any books at all. But that would be stretching things, because humans naturally inject emotions into their words, and the most devoutly religious (I'm going to cite Evangelists in particular here) feel that they have a purpose in trying to convert others to the 'right' religion for their own good. So whether you want it or not, discussion will continue, because it's a very important and sensitive issue. That's why people will continue to write, explain, and publish their views: because they feel it necessary that others see why they chose to be the way they are so that the others do not try to force the them to change. Ideally, yes, there would be no need to spend that much time arguing against a personal decision like religion. But human nature is curious, spastic, and dogmatic, and tends to thwart efforts to the contrary.
#503 Old 1st Mar 2009 at 10:18 PM
Why is Agnostic not listed?!

1. Is there a supreme being?
I need PROOF.

2. Why is your (if you have one) religion the right one?
I have no opinion why, it's just what I believe.

3. Is atheism wrong?
No, why should it be wrong?

4. Are atheists at a disadvantage in today's theistic world?
Lmao... All I have to say.

5. Is it okay for atheists to try to spread their views?
Everyone else does, why not?

6. Is religion (in general) becoming more powerful or fading out?
Fading. People are starting to break off into their own minds now.
#504 Old 2nd Mar 2009 at 12:20 AM
Good posts yinakori

And Henry, I believe the reason why agnostic is not listed is because it leaves a bitter tastes in the mouths of many atheists. including myself (I like to say I am an agnostic atheist, and here's why). Whenever I tell people I am agnostic, it's as if they think that there is still hope for me to convert to a religion or start believing in their god because ultimately I am undecided, or at least that is the definition of agnosticism. Saying you are an atheist however, confirms to any believer that you are not interested in religion or god unless they provide you with cold hard evidence. Don't know if I make much sense, but it makes sense in my mind and I'm bad at translating my inner dialogue :P
Scholar
#505 Old 2nd Mar 2009 at 6:16 AM
1. Is there a supreme being?
You bet your infidel butt there is! (For those who lack the much need humor gene, that was a joke.)
2. Why is your (if you have one) religion the right one?
Because it is the only one. It's a long story but basically Islam was the only faith sanctioned by God, but over the years people began worshiping idols and placing other gods with God. So while some people believe that Polytheism was first Muslims believe that Monotheism was first and later on people forgot their promise to God and were lead astray by Satan (Cause he wanted reveange for being kicked out of heaven for not bowing to Adam like God told him. I feel pity towards Satan.) All religions were Islam before they were curropted. Please note that Islam means to submit to God's will. That does not mean that they had the same laws, or scriptures of modern Muslims. Which they don't.
3. Is atheism wrong?
Yes.
4. Are atheists at a disadvantage in today's theistic world?
Is the world Theistic? I see it as more spiritual but back to the point. It depends on where they are. In Africa, Latin America, Middle East, Asia and the Bible Belt they are at a disadvantage but in Europe they're safe...for now. :D
5. Is it okay for atheists to try to spread their views?
To other non-Muslim groups. But not to Muslims. How can I control them if they don't believe the same thing I do? D:
6. Is religion (in general) becoming more powerful or fading out?
See number 4 for that. :D
Inventor
#506 Old 2nd Mar 2009 at 3:05 PM
Quote: Originally posted by Black_Barook!
1. Is there a supreme being?
You bet your infidel butt there is! (For those who lack the much need humor gene, that was a joke.)
2. Why is your (if you have one) religion the right one?
Because it is the only one. It's a long story but basically Islam was the only faith sanctioned by God, but over the years people began worshiping idols and placing other gods with God. So while some people believe that Polytheism was first Muslims believe that Monotheism was first and later on people forgot their promise to God and were lead astray by Satan (Cause he wanted reveange for being kicked out of heaven for not bowing to Adam like God told him. I feel pity towards Satan.) All religions were Islam before they were curropted. Please note that Islam means to submit to God's will. That does not mean that they had the same laws, or scriptures of modern Muslims. Which they don't.
3. Is atheism wrong?
Yes.
4. Are atheists at a disadvantage in today's theistic world?
Is the world Theistic? I see it as more spiritual but back to the point. It depends on where they are. In Africa, Latin America, Middle East, Asia and the Bible Belt they are at a disadvantage but in Europe they're safe...for now. :D
5. Is it okay for atheists to try to spread their views?
To other non-Muslim groups. But not to Muslims. How can I control them if they don't believe the same thing I do? D:
6. Is religion (in general) becoming more powerful or fading out?
See number 4 for that. :D


My comments are to address your words only.

Religion and the religious have taken God and cut Him up into many little pieces and distributed Him to every corner of the world and turned Him into individual/many gods. If that was not enough, they have all limited Him to a book with the argument that my God is better than your God teachings that has no resemblance to God Himself.

In all seriousness, we end up with parts of God that are limited to the parts we hold on to and we delude our self into thinking we process the whole of God. The foundation that has been copied and distributed are flawed because the model was flawed. If God indeed wanted to limit Himself to a book, there is not enough books in this world that could contain Him.

Frankly, I think that atheist are more honest in that they know something is missing in the God promoted by man, wherever these men are planted, and they are true to them self, not willing to sell out to the big lie promoted by man.

I will give Islam this: They have recognized the misunderstanding of/about Jesus but yet and still repeated that misunderstanding with Mohammad. The good news is, God did not cooperate with man's plan, as it should be the other way around. The proof of this is the continued state of a world under attack by men that are so inwardly cowardice/spineless that he turned his war on God against/toward himself/humanity.

In conclusion, God is not dead, he is not a book, and He still promotes Himself in all Honesty and Truth, regardless of the stance we may take. He is kool with any stance we take, the proof is, He has not wipe the religious off of the face of the map!
Moderator of Extreme Limericks
#507 Old 3rd Mar 2009 at 7:23 PM
This thread has surpassed the ridiculously long mark (500 posts), so I'm going to go ahead and close it before it gets even more unwieldy.

:locked

There's always money in the banana stand.
 
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