Everybody has brought up good points. I think it is good if a women is raped or the pregnancy is an accident.

Do you listen to your self when you speak? The "deformed are not fit to live in our society" attitude bears a striking resemblence to many things I would think you disagree with. If I were you, I would take that statement back before Godwin's Law comes into effect.

I think you'll be my first favorite person on here, hszmv. You shall now enter my signature. I am your fangirl now.

I think lots of people here forgot a point that Catwalk did say.
Protection is not 100%.
You can take the pill and still get pregnant.
There's not such thing as " If these woman was irresponsible enough to have unprotected sex, then she should keep the baby, tha will teach her responsabilities". I've seen this in lots of posts and i'm shocked.
First pregnant does not mean unprotected sex, as i said it before.
Then, the people who are against abortment, say they care for a life but what is it to say that a baby will be here to teach responsability to his parents. If the parents are not responsible enough or not ready, why force them to have a kid who won't be taken care of correctly.
I think it's everyone right to decide in a correct time limit, and they have the right too not to be insulted or called murderer.

The point of the post you quoted was not about anyone being fit to live in our society, it was about doing something for the sake of a possible child who, if brought into the world, would never be able to function well, would suffer immensely, and would probably die very young as a result of a horrible deformity. Also, Kakashi_Hatake was referring to a child without a face who could not breathe or eat by herself, not someone with Downs Syndrome or similar.

i agree with daisie. i have heard of many children going through horible things like they cannot breath . why would anyone want to put there child through that kind of pain.

i am on the fence on this topic because one, my brother has a child. and his ex had the child at an early age. and i can never imagine living with out my neice she is like a sister.

then my friend she is very irresponsible when it comes to sex ,and i dont think she should ever have sex, but she does. and has some close calls when it comes to being preggers. and we are both 16. and she has been having sex since we were 13. so in that case if she has a kid its her fault and she should take responiblity.

and then i think about being in the situation at a young age and using protection but what if it doesn work because protection is not perfect. so in that case i would want an abortion. i have a whole life ahead of me and i dont think i would have the time to truely care for my child. and i mean emotionally. i want to have time for my kid and really be there for them. it messes kids up when there parents are not there for them. they are more prone to being bad because there is not someone at home at all times. but thats another subject.

and i also think that if you are raped you have the right to get an abortion 100%.
then i think its is not right for a girl to abort after a certain amount of time.
such as 4 months in. because you had time to think about it.

but even so. i think it should be the persons own desicion. could you imagine if this becomes illegal 100%? then the government might think they can have control over your body in a way. whats next they will make having alot of peircings and big tattos illegal as well?

I would have zero problem with having an abortion if I got pregnant right now.

I already have two children, and am currently working and studying to support my family. I am the sole breadwinner, and a lot of money, time and effort has been put into my education. To put my family on hiatus for the next five years or so is in no way fair, just or right.

I've read here about the rights of the baby to live. I don't agree. I have rights to live, and live how I want, and did not give those rights up to nature, or to someone as yet unborn. I am not bound by nature to go through a pregnancy and give birth if I don't wish to. I don't care that people are waiting for babies to adopt - my body is my own and I am not beholden to others.

Not to mention that if I had another child I would never adopt, and this new baby would seriously effect the quality of my other children's lives, through having to spread money further, resources split, and time split.

I'm mostly a lurker in the debate room, but here's my opinion:

In cases of rape, abortion is a-okay. Personally, I'm against all abortion, but if the alternative is that women would have no choice with their body once they became pregnant, than I want to keep it legal.

And now, to go back to my lurking ways!

In my opinion abortion should be a perfectly legal alternative to adoption and should be considered more than adoption,because most children that are put up for adoptin are never adopted and have to suffer a life of poverty in adoption homes. Just think if abortion become ilegal and women had to go out onto the streets to find somebody that will do it. Even if it she could find someone to do it. Would that person use clean tools? Dispose of the body properly? Use proper medication? etc. The answer to that is no why take something away that will help fetuses not to be born into a life of poverty,hate or violence.

(I agree with Romyhorse and calalily...)
-Elle

Personally, I am pro-choice. I am not going to go into detail, since I've stated my opinions on other abortion threads already (and because many of my arguments have already been said) but my main issue is CHOICE. Personally, unless my or my unborn child's life were in danger, or said child would be born with a horrible deformity that would cause him or her to have a short life or one full of pain, I would not abort.

That being said, what is right for me is not right for everyone else. I am currently in a stable relationship with someone that I love very much and I know that if I got pregnant we would raise our child together. However, some women are not so lucky. Some are mere teenagers when they get pregnant. Yes you can say "They shouldn't have sex at that age blah blah blah". Okay. You're right, they shouldn't be having sex at age 15. But they did. A ridiculously high number of teenage fathers don't stick around for their child - I don't remember the exact number, sorry, but I will try to find a source. Frankly, why would they? They have their whole lives ahead of them and they don't want to ruin it. So the responsibility lies solely on the mother, who is likely unprepared, not financially stable and absolutely terrified. It takes two to tango - if the father is allowed to bail, why can the mother not have that same option? Why should HER life be ruined because of a mistake by BOTH parties? Sure, she could adopt it out, but there is still the physical aspects of pregnancy and childbirth to deal with, emotional changes and the social stigma of being "that girl who got knocked up." It's not right and it's not fair.

I can understand the pro-life argument. However, I do not agree that a fetus is a child until it is born. Technically, you cannot die before you are born, so therefore, it should not be classified as murder.

The key in pro-choice is CHOICE. What is right for me is not always right for everyone (or anyone) else, so therefore, why should everyone have to comply with MY standards and values? And vice versa, of course. It is up to the woman to make a decision that is right for HER and that is not for anyone else to decide. It's her body and it's her life. Not yours. If you don't like abortions, don't have one - but don't you dare tell me what I can or cannot do with my own body and my own life.

If science can ever prove that abortion is murder, I am sure that my standards will change. Until then, however, to each her own.

Wow. So much for not going into detail

I see a lot of the "if young girls get pregnant, they should have to deal with it so they'll learn" in here... I completely disagree with that idea. Babies should never be a means to teach someone a lesson. It's not good for the mother or the baby for it to be that way. I'm not saying I think teenagers should be able to go out and have sex with each other with no consequences. That's what chlamydia is for. ((please don't take that seriously, I don't actually think that.))

As much as I don't like abortion, I think it should stay legal. Some people just shouldn't have kids and those people seem to be the ones who are bad about taking their birth control.

That's a really big claim, and I'd like to see the concrete statistics where you're getting such information.

Now, I think when talking about abortion vs. adoption there is a simple fact that people tend to glaze over. While it's true that older children are not adopted as easily, that is NOT the case for newborns, which should be the age any child would be if the mother was deciding between abortion and adoption.

In fact, if a girl found herself pregnant, she is able to begin the adoption process before her child is even born. You go to a family lawyer specializing in adoption and talk to them. You sign some papers (not signing away parental rights yet, just agreeing to confidentiality and such) and are then given files on people waiting to adopt a child. The biological mother is then given a choice of which couple she would prefer her child to go to. Also, the biological mother may be able to arrange either an "open" adoption in which she receives pictures and communicates with the parents and child throughout the child's life, or a "closed" adoption where there is no communication. The adoptive parents then pay for EVERYTHING. The cost of prenatal care, the cost of the birth, the cost of counseling before and after the birth, as well as the cost of maternity clothes, the cost of the lawyer, and anything else needed.

So, no, I'd have to disagree that if you're pregnant and don't want a child, your child won't be adopted. If you are pro-active about persuing adoption, it will happen, and there is absolutely no reason not to be pro-active if you would otherwise have an abortion.

I'm sorry, but people saying adoption is not an option really sets me off. I was one of those teenagers that gets pregnant before they're ready. I was 15. I made a mistake. There was no way I was going to make that child pay for my mistake. I did what was outlined above. I talk to my son's parents. I talk to my son. I see him every few years. He is very happy. He knows that I am his biological mother and he knows why I did what I did. His parents were picked out and I knew where he would be living and who he'd be living with by the time I was 5 months pregnant. Everything was already taken care of. He was born, his parents came to the hospital. It was hard, it was emotional, but most importantly it was right for me.

I know what worked for me, won't work for everyone...but I do think there is a horrible misconception about adoption that girls fall into. This belief that their child will live in poverty in a foster home...that isn't the case if one acts proactively.

It is one of the most public policy issues being debated about today. My first reason is that the majoritory of religions disapprove euthanasia, they disapprove because they believe that every human has a special place in God’s heart, eyes and creation.. Also for religious and moral reasons that human live is sacred, for these reasons it might be difficult for doctors and nursing staff to actually administer euthanasia according to there own religious beliefs. It must be very difficult for some people to agree with euthanasia because deep down they might believe the ill persons health could improve and they might eventually get better.
My reasons for euthanasia are that you could have prolonged agony from a family seeing a loved one suffer. If an individual when of sound mind expresses a desire for euthanasia with a progression of a terminal illness for instance then that persons wishes should be respected and allow them to die with dignity. Maybe this would help families to remember their loved ones in a more positive way instead of having to watch them suffer. Euthanasia is considered to be a pain free death where an individual would just slip into sleep and then death.
Economically euthanasia could perhaps reduce financial and nursing obligations. If somebody chose to die rather than spend months on a hospital ward when there is no chance in recovery. Everyone should be entitled to freedom of choice whether he or she lives or dies with respect of family and friends wishes. Euthanasia is not a private act you have the support your family and friends. Terminally patients are often cared for by family members or they may go into hospices. Hospices are specially designed facilities for people who are terminally ill along with supporting families. There are three types of hospices they are, to relieve pain, to enable patients and families to face up death and to care for the emotional needs of relatives.
My opinion on euthanasia is that It’s a really controversial issue which is never going to be agreed on or disagreed on totally because there will always be conflicting opinions and views.

I belive that Abortion is wrongand my Faith confirms what I belive, however it should not be illegal. MY Reasoning: if its illegal women are going to find a way on the internet to do it at home and possibly harm themselves or cause pre-birth injury to the baby(yes baby, I refuse to call the child a "Fetus").

And this whole "Deformity-Genitic health issues" thing doesnt sit well with me, my brother has Cerebral Palsy and I cant imagine my life without him, he is wonderful and while he may be a pain in the rear at time with his tantrums he makes us better people.

That is not what the argument is. It is about the whole play with fire you may get burned. Give it up for adoption, that is a responscible choice. Getting pregnant is a very responsible choice. You are basicily attempting to create life. However, there are a number of people who are irresponsible in their decision to practice sex, protected or otherwise. The baby isn't a learning tool, hell, I know people with kids they really can't afford who haven't learned a damn thing. The guy mooched of his mother and father, went to wild parties, and held jobs at a whim, both before and after. He still let's his mother do most of the parenting for the baby while he went out and partied. A child isn't a boogy man to scare away hormone driven fifteen year olds from sex, it is a child, a life, and a human being. It also happens onto this crazy world through the act of sex.

But I wouldn't classify Cerebral Palsy as a disease/condition worth aborting for. Nor would I include diseases or conditions like Downs' Syndrome, deafness, blindness or autism. But there are some deformities that can cause incredible amounts of pain, emotionally and physically, for parents and child. For example, and correct me if I'm wrong, but spina bifida is one of these cases. I heard a story about a baby that was born this disease (I'm pretty sure it was spina bifida) whose spinal cord was exposed. This child was in severe pain and died only a few months later.

In a situation such as that, I think that abortion is not only necessary, but the right thing to do.

I wasnt saying that Cerebral Palsy was one of those diseases, I was just applying a personal experience where some would consider the child "Abnormal" to my thoughts on the matter.

Aborting a Child is never necessary, it may make the life of a parent easier but what about that child who will never get to decide for him/her self whether or not to live? Ask those who live with Spina Bifida if they wish they had been aborted?

Oh, no, I don't necessarily agree with someone aborting a fetus because the child could/will have cerebral palsy. I mean things like the example I had in my first post, where the girl literally didn't have a face. There is no way that child will ever function by herself. She's having surgery after surgery, her face is covered in tubes and wires and bars to try to create something so she can live, but her life will never be normal and will be filled with excrutiating, awful pain.
Spina bifida CAN be helped and lived with. But in georgiababe's example the baby was born with their spinal cord exposed and was in severe pain. Would you rather your child's only view of the world ever before it dies to be terrible, terrible pain?

EDIT - I reread my post. And come to think of it, what if you were a young mother who found out her child was going to have a crazy, hard to deal with mental disorder? Would you be able to take care of it? I thought about it for a second and I know that I personally would not be able to do it. I can't even fathom watching my child suffer like that.

To me, adoption would be far more harder than an abortion. I don't think it's a person yet when you'd get an abortion. Adoption is when you have to carry it around with you for nine months, and then hand it away. It just seems like it would be so much harder. Not saying that an abortion would be hard, but, I dunno. Just my reasoning, I guess.

It wont matter because after death there will only be happieness and joy. (Or some people belive there will be nothiningness but even then you wont remeber, you wouldnt be there.)

That is most defiantly not what I meant, people in general are mean. They abhor people that are different from them. We live in a society of ideals and supposed to(s). If someone is different thier life is going to be hell, why do that to someone? Also no where in my statement did I say they did not have a right to live, everyone does. I'm just saying that I think thier lives would be alot harsher. Most of these people that are born with deformities are usally placed on diplay or on TV because people want to see it and that's just cruel, noone should be on display or treated like a piece of meat, and in today's society they in fact are. It's a sad reality deal with it. I know alot of people that are mentally handicapped, they're fun to be around. But people with sever deformities like the little kid with no face, she should not have to put up with a life of hell and pain. She should be able to be a kid, something she won;t ever be able to experience. Being severly deformed and having something mentally wrong with you is totally different.

While I am personally against abortion, I do not think it should be banned. It's not my place to say who can or cannot receive one.

Personally, I don't understand how those can say they are against but only in the case of [insert whatever you want]. It just seems hypocritical to me.

Well to my belief system (Not knocking your's, mind you.) I don't think you go anywhere when you die. So that baby's only life experience was torture. I just don't think it's right. I'd rather have my baby never have to suffer than be in pain.

but if you dont go anywhere when you die, you wouldnt be able to remember anything that happened in your life and neither would the child.

I think this debate needs an injection of biology. So, here I am to give it some.

Firstly, the debate is not about whether the fetus is alive. As any biologist will tell you, a sperm cell is alive, an egg is alive, a fertilised cell is alive and so is a fetus. Thus, abortion is certainly an act of killing. However, there are no laws in our society prohibiting killing outright (only laws against certain types of killing). I can swat a fly, clearly a living creature, without breaking any law. So obviously, this is beside the point - there are deeper issues than "when does life begin?", such as "when does a 'person' begin?".

Secondly, a fetus will have a survival instinct. It will avoid dangers, it can feel pain, has a heartbeat and so on. But, so does that housefly I mentioned above, and I would not offend many people (Jains perhaps, but nobody else) by killing that fly. Thus, our society does allow you to kill things that have these properties. So, those properties are beside the point.

This is an argument about morality and ethics. It is primarily a 'feeling' sort of thing. As a biologist, I can't make these decisions for you, but I certainly will try to make sure you get the science right in order to make the most informed decisions that you can.

All children with spina bifida have their spinal cord exposed at birth. This is not a problem unless the parents refuse to consent to the operation to close the wound.

Doctors advise that children with spina bifida be aborted, including 25 weeks pregnant. I know because my 11 year old son has spina bifida, and I was offered an abortion. I didn't take it because the death rate for mothers climbs to 70% at that time, and is very risky.

As for being "the right thing to do" - no. I was told when pregnant that my son would be a vegetable, unable to walk, talk, or move, and that I should abort him. The only thing that stopped me was the death rate, and thankfully led me to enquire more. I was then told by a midwife that my son had a 95% of walking. By the way, my son won third place at the cross country for his school a couple of years ago.

Doctors lie about this all the time - in the belief that it's better for the mother if the baby just be gone. This is why I would not just take professional advice and leave it at that.