This is the same Republican agenda that is going to drive our country into an early grave if we let it go any further. I don't mean to generalize and say that all Republicans are like this, so when I refer to Republicans in this post, please understand that I mean the ones in the limelight turning this country into a shambles. I honestly cannot even begin to wrap my mind around why so many Republicans feel the need to browbeat people into submission and rob every natural right they possess- is it such a foreign concept to simply live and let live? I don't care what her religion preaches, but not everyone shares her religion, and the seperation of church and state is critical. Palin cannot allow her moral inhibitions to interfere with her political career, just as any other politican cannot. It's narrow-minded, selfish people like Palin that make me want to move out of the USA. We need change, not the same old stifling Republican policies.

wtf? and must I repeat...wft?? Sarah Palin has lost her mind, hasn't she?

Gays have the same rights stated in constitution, where it says (basically) that all men (and women) are created equally. Gays are people and being gay doesn't mean you have an illness, what is their for her to "save" and "convert"? There is no argument against gay rights without religion telling you it's wrong. If you tell a gay that he can't have rights because he/she is gay, isn't it weird that he could do the same thing to you? Another point, gay people haven't just chosen to be gay. They are affected by an interesting little phenomenon we call evolution.
If you say you aren't racist or sexist, but you hate gay people then you are a liar. Gay people are just another race like African Americans, Latin Americans, American, British, or German. We have gotten over racism for the most part in the world, so why do people still hate gays?
Their ways of life are not corrupting our youth, our government, or anything else for that matter, that they are people just like we are. They have thoughts and feelings and most likely more issues with their sexuality than she thinks, though in some cases not. When you say things like you want to "convert" and "save" the gays, just imagine how it would feel if it were you, just because you are the way you are.
Why does it matter to you Mrs. Homophobe it's not like they are having gay sex in front of you or praising satan, purposely going against your religion or anything? Why do you care? Is it any of your business if a couple get married whether it's man to woman, woman to woman, or man to man? No is the answer I wanted and if you disagree with me, then too bad, because you are wrong any two people who legitimately love each should, and will be allowed to marry one another.

-Sorry for getting all serious but I had a friend, he was my neighbor and he killed himself cuz he was gay and his parents didn't approve of it and students were picking on him at school.

It's people like Sarah Palin that makes USA a harder place to live in.

Wrong. What makes gay people different from you is their sexuality, not their race. In fact, the other characteristics you mentioned are examples of ethnicity, also not race.

But I know what you were trying to say, and I agree. If the Republicans are going to judge Barack Obama by the people he used to hang out with or met once, or whatever, then the "but it's her church's opinion, not hers!" argument is basically the definition of hypocricy. But anyway, I don't need to focus on her church's programs. Her own, stated beliefs and policies are enough to make me sick.

have you been living under a rock!? samatha ronson is lindsay's lesbian british DJ finance (who looks exactly like pete doherty).

I usually don't poke my nose in anything that's political/sexual/religious, but I wanted to say that I hope all of this blows over and thier "saving and curing" goes away. Last I heard they said being gay was a genetic thing, had to do with some sort of strand in the DNA. Almost like hermaphrodites- where someone is born with both sex organs but thier genetic make up is of one sex (all DNA based). (yea I might sound outdated on my info, but its what I feel is the truth) I am not saying hermaphrodites are gay- what I am saying is that its something in the creation of the person- its not a choice or a plan they chose- its what they know is right in thier hearts and souls as a person. Anyway, Christians cannot save someone from being themselves and they cannot save people from the power of prayer- honestly really. The ONLY way someone can be saved is if the person being saved excepts Jesus Christ as thier savior and knew he died for thier sins. And there are gay Christians and they are saved and OMG they are still gay- holy cow- saving does NOT cure someone of thier sins nor does it make them anymore Christian then the next folk. Being saved just means your more likely to go to heaven- if you even believe in heaven. (To me its NOT a sin to love someone with all your heart and want to spend your life with them. A sin to me is killing, rape and other things that are harmful or hateful.) My husband is a Christian and he's said many times to me thats how a person is saved. He's also said standing in your garage doesn't make you a car, no more then saying your Christian doesn't make you a Christian. The actions of a person reflects if they are true Christians. And most Christians I have met, don't agree with what gays stand for (which is in the bible a marriage is stated man and woman- thats why Christians are uptight), but they do not bash them or try to change them, they just kinda avoid the topic out of respect of different POV. The extreme folks that wanna do all this horrible stuff to gays are the villians and gays should not be the targets at all. Gays are no different then you and I, in my opinion if your gay it just means you like something I don't- wouldn't be any different if you prefered brunettes over red heads. Sometimes theres no explanation to that whole theory either- why some like one hair color over another. Anyway, I just hope that everything goes well in the end and the energies of the polititians are focused on our countries suffering of energy and economy. From what my husband said- since the 2 big lenders collapsed our country could be looking at a big fall in many things worst then the great depression- but who knows maybe our new president might grow a brain and a pair and do something miraculous for our country and not meddle in the personal lives of our people.
by the way- there are many types of Christians and therefor many different ideas and beleifs. The Alaskan church sounds extreme and scary to me.
*Hugs* Everything will work out hun, just be patient and think positive thoughts.
And I am Christian (I use the term losely) as I don't attend church as I am not into the whole "lets all talk about God". I also beleive in animals have a soul and yes you can talk to ghosts.
I hope your worries are simmered and you can sleep a more restful sleep.

While I risk throwing this thread offtopic I feel this is pretty much on topic. Things like that, saving and curing gays, isn't new news, down here in the bible belt there are camps dedicated to this, I know of a few in Tennessee. They don't work they only let those that go meet likeminded individuals. One of my friends was forced to go to one, but got kicked out along with the boyfriend he made there lol When I saw this thread I wasn't going to comment but it seems like not many really know about the conversion camps that are run by the southern baptists...but my point is this kind of thinking doesn't surprise me, nor am I really worried about it, they can't force anyone to do anything unless that person is under their care(ie their child), if they tried there would be a multitude of lawsuits.

Some info:
http://gaylife.about.com/od/religion/i/ex_gay.htm

I would hope not! I am very fond of Gothicism and I live life with very dark views and thoughts and see darkness as just another form of beauty and I do like the goth style/makeup, etc. It would make me so upset if everyone were to be forced to be preppy since being preppy is the most accepted lifestyle.



Yes but when these Log Cabin members vote for the Republicans who are very anti-gay and want to take away their rights as homosexuals, that to me is a load of shit and they are just being hypocritical. They are basically risking themselves and voting for the ones who are more likely to reject or change them. And all for what? Huh? I see no logic in being gay and voting for an anti-gay candidate. Again, Log Cabin is a bunch of hypocrities. Sure, there are plenty of anti-gay Democrats, but why is it that there seems to be more anti-gay Republicans than there are anti-gay Democrats? Try answering that.



Why the hell should I even know who Samantha is? I could care less who she is and I don't spend my free time prying on the lives of the rich and famous. I don't read much about celebrities because they are no better or more special than us little people. And besides, if I dislike Lindsay Lohan as it is, why the hell should I be expected to know who any of her friends are if I don't even keep up with her life? I only posted this blog because it wasn't Lindsay, but because it was about the actual topic in regards to Palin. So for your information, I do NOT live under a rock, I just don't care who Samantha is.



That was very kind of you and it means a lot to me. Thank you!

*sigh* I just feel like my life is worthless at times because it's so difficult for me to live life. Being gay, being into goth, being dark and edgy minded, being a bit crazy, suffering from Major Depression/A.D.D./L.D.'s, having been constantly bullied my whole life, never fitting in with the norm or wherever I go, etc. There is only so much you can take of all this. And this is the answer... for us to just be cured? What happens if hypothetically I did get "cured"? I am not very masculine as it is and most women do not like that. I could not even support a woman or children, I can't even support my own damn self. Sure, I'd make my family very happy, but I would never be happy. I would be extremely miserable and constantly longing to be with a man while being stuck with a woman who do not deserve to be in such a situation. I would have to NEVER have any contact with men because I know that eventually I will lust some of them or maybe even fall in love with them. I'd have to be completely sheltered, even more sheltered than I currently am. I hate it when gays marry the opposite sex and even have kids with them and still end up cheating on their spouses with the same sex behind their backs. And it happens way too often. So much for "curing", huh? If there truly were a cure, then why the hell is this happening? Too many gays who try to convert end up miserable and even suicidal as well. Unless you are gay yourself, you will never understand the pain that comes with this lifestyle. Trust me, if a medicine to make you straight ever existed and that it truly made you straight in an instant, many gays and even bisexuals would be taking it like crazy at whatever the cost would be. This world would also be way more populated. If gays had never existed, this world would be way too overcrowded, thus forcing laws to be stricter and allowing you to only have a limited number of children.



Been there and done that, only when I have tried to commit suicide many times in my life it never worked. Three years ago I had attempted suicide by overdosing on my medication with over 20 pills in a row. I was very lucky to be alive after being rushed to the ER. So I share my pain with you in this subject because I, too, was that boy. Even though I have improved a bit mentally and have not made anymore attempts in three years come this November, I still am trying hard to love and accept myself. That's the hardest part. Low self-esteem really kills. And therapy and my medication is really not helping all that much.

Can you imagine if we had all loved and accepted one another since the beginning of time? We would never have to rely on medication and therapy just to be "fixed". There would never be any mental clinics because there would not be a need for them. I can't help but blame organized religions that go to the extremes of things, corrupt people who are in power and money and objects of high value. All of that is what really makes evil when you think about it.

srsly man..she has bigger issues to deal with.... shes a hardcore Christian who belives in "saveing " your self untill marriage with a freaking preggers daughter whos younger then me...yea i bet that looked good at sunday's mass ... then she gets all high and might with her pro-life bull... srsly? go worrie about how you look at church before getting all up in the poor gay's business...


i dont like her at all... and i never really "liked" mccain but after picking HER as his vice.. i really really really dont like him

Yes, and most anti-gay people believe that. But that will not stop them hating gay people, just like it won't stop people hating rapists. They think being gay is a morally repugnant lifestyle choice, not something that you are born with.


Something which people who are anti-gay, like Gov. Palin, don't usually think is true.


Yeah, I think what Dreamydre meant was that being prejudice towards gay people is morally equal to being prejudice towards race. That is, that their differences are not morally relevant to their status as people.


It's partially genetic, but also significantly influenced by the hormones present in the womb.


Again, that can be genetic, but can also be due to uterine hormones.


Yes, I've heard the same thing said when I mention that some gay people are Christians. The implication is that they are not real Christians, because they are gay - and being homosexual is not something that Christ would have done, so doing that is acting in an un-Christian manner. Or something.


That's because they are interpreting the Bible differently.

Take 1 Corinthians 6:9-11, which reads (in the New King James Version):

Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites, nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God. And such were some of you. But you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus and by the Spirit of our God.

There you have it, the reason why these Christians want to save the gays - because the Bible says that a homosexual can't enter into heaven, and that they need to be sanctified in the name of Jesus, and once they have been they will no longer be gay. (Note it doesn't say 'such are some of you' but 'such were some of you' - indicating that nobody who has been washed and sanctified is homosexual.

Yes, and I believe in that part. I believe there's different types of gays. Some are genetic BUT some are lifestyle. Let me tell you, I have two gay friends, whose (I think) homosexuality are not genetic.

The first one, he was straight, he fantasized about girls, dated girls, and sleep with girls. Then one day he watched gay porn on the net, and now he's gay. He said he no longer can get turned on by a woman.

Second one, he was a homosexual since he's a kid, dated other boys at school, and he even was a transsexual after he's graduated from college (He's way older than me). I never really met him anymore for a few years, then one day I ran into him and there he is a straight man now. He's dating a woman, and there's no sign that he was once a transsexual. Strange, I tell you.

see treeag. i dont agree with that... maby your friends are or were bisexual... because i dont think its a just a lifestyle for anyone.. i think your born gay...live gay...and die gay if your gay...

my best friend for example when i met her.. she thougt she was straight... but one day when we were drinking in my room she was like do you ever fantise about another girl when your haveing sex? i was liek no blah blah blah

then 2 weeks later she finaly was like im bi and told everyone she was bi or w/e. then we were talking again.. and she was like know what twiggzy? i dont think im attracted to guys like at all.. i never really was... i think im a lezzie.. and i was liek oh true? and now shes out... but shes not going to gay bars every day like IM HERE IM QUEER GET USED TO IT... thats just who she is....

I don't know but we talked and they said they definitely not bi. *shrugs* I won't think it's weird and won't bother to post that if they were bi.

hmm idk then... with your first example... though.. he could have been hiding the face that hes gay then one day was just like eff it im tired of hideing im gay!

Treeag, they were most likely just in the closet at the time. It's easier to get more confused when a kid hits puberty because all sorts of hormones and things start to erupt. Homosexuality is something that you are born with but you don't necessarily identify it right away until you have realized it more and/or felt more comfortable with it. Some even know it as a kid. When people say they used to be this and they are now that, it's mostly because they were either in denial at first, not comfortable with their sexuality and/or didn't even realize it because they had never been exposed to it to not even fully understand their sexuality. If a man who had never been exposed to homosexuality at all started dating the opposite sex, they may not even realize their sexuality just yet. But once they experience homosexuality is when they realize that that is what they lean towards. If they were truly straight then that homosexual experience would have done nothing to them. Some people are just that sheltered until they experience/experiment.

So what about the second guy?

Source: http://gaylife.about.com/od/religion/i/ex_gay.htm

I'm not surprised. Such programs have always been false. Duh? It's just so sad how much hate there really is. And it always comes from ignorance. People are just so damn ignorant it's not even funny.

*On a different note, here is something very interesting about Obama. He fully supports LGBT in this Q&A session. He is actually willing to do everything in his power to make sure that we are all truly equal, gay or straight. I just hope that he really means this and that he actually does do something about it. Another reason why Obama is the polar opposite of Palin.

Source: http://www.southernvoice.com/2008/9...tional/9143.cfm

I don't believe that. It's not that I don't want to, it's that it's not true. He is just full of shit or he experienced something that made him decide to just live a straight life. But my previous post about the first source I quoted is a better explanation. People just want to believe the second guy's situation because they favor heterosexuality, that's all.

I don't really get what do you mean he's full of shit. I saw him when he was a transsexual and I saw him the way he is now. That's weird.

Treeag, you don't go from being gay to straight, nor do you go from being straight to gay. And he could have been bisexual for all we know and just didn't want to admit it because bisexuals have a bad reputation for being incapable of being in relationships. But yeah, trust me, if I could truly turn straight, I'd have done so long ago. Why would I even want to go through half the things I went through? When I said "full of shit" I just meant that he was lying. I myself went through many phases of wanting to be a woman but they went away eventually. That is not uncommon.

i def agree.. one hundred percent.

sometimes people go in to "hiding" because they cant take the ridicule they get.. its not like gay people CANT have sex with the oppsite sex.. i mean they might not like it.. but it is possible for it to happen...


just like straight women... sometimes i get drunk and... things happen >.> that dosent make me gay or bi. it means i have a very low tolerance for alcohol.

frankie... if i havent mentioned it before... i love you...<3 haha will you be my bff [que the two little yellow smiliefaces in my relationship meter! <3]

Ok. I understand completely what you're saying. I don't really care though, it's not like I still see him often.

Back on the topic, I do believe homosexuality can be 'cured' through prayers (now I don't think that's a right word as it's not a disease, but I can't find the word right now). That is my belief and I'm not trying to shove it to anybody's face. But I do believe God's power is beyond anything you can imagine. Adjusting a gene, I believe, is easy for Him.

Just like how a friend of my uncle was diagnosed with cancer and was about to go for a surgery, then miracle happened and when the surgeon performed the surgery they can't find the cancer anymore. Miracles do happen. Yeah it's not a gene in my example, but just wanted to show that God can change physical things.

So that's my belief and if it's different with yours, fine. I just want to share mine and I'm not trying to shove it down anyone's throat. I'm not the type of Christians who actively and aggressively trying to convert people anyway. I'm fine with my belief I couldn't careless with other people's.


Anyway, I read your long post up there frankie, and I can sorta feel your pain. If you don't believe the prayers then it doesn't matter to you as Palin's prayer will never affect you. And I don't consider myself against homosexuals, I think people should be left as they are. I mean, if you meet a gay person who's comfortable being gay and not asking for your help or anything, I'm not the type of people who'll aggressively trying to give them so-called advice and help.

Now the situation might be different if they themselves bring the subject up and desperately want to change (my li'l brother has a friend like this) but even then I can't and won't force them to change. I believe people have free will, and they can take care of themselves without intervention from anybody else.

Awww, of course! Thank you!

By the way... another reason why Palin's plan is pointless from one of the previous links I posted:



See? If homosexuality was truly curable, then why do these things happen? Why don't they ever "stay" straight after converting? Not that they were ever straight to begin with, but you know what I mean.

hahaha he was seen at a gay bar? riight after saying how he was"cured" hahah thats an amazingly stupid move on his part. but it prooves my point one can not wake up one day and be like i think im gay today. and the next day be like i feel kinda straight today .

it just never happens like that

oh and frankie... dont say you would not be gay if you had the chance we love your gayness <3

I believe you are not trying to shove this down our throats and for someone believing that homosexuality is a sin you sure handle this a lot better than some people I know on here whose name I will not mention (I think you probably know who if you read a lot of these debates, lol).

And I have known of "miracles" to work as in so and so person had so and so disease or whatever and no longer had it. Or even that in my life I almost died three times from asthma attacks as a baby and my parents and family prayed for me and I survived, just like I survived the suicidal attempt I explained earlier. I have not had asthma since I was a kid, I just grew out of it. I'm not a Christian and I don't believe in God but I think the reason why these "miracles" happen is probably because of luck. I have even prayed for God to change my sexuality when I used to believe in Him but obviously it never happened. I used to pray to be able to see without glasses but that never worked. I even prayed to eliminate all of my facial and body hair to be completely smooth and that never worked. Prayers don't work, I think it's just luck. If prayers did work however, then the reason for God to not cure homosexuality but to actually cure diseases is because homosexuality is not harmful and is not a disease/virus like cancer is. It won't ruin your life as in you will not get physically ill from it. Asking God to heal your homosexuality is the equivalent of asking God to change your skin tone or eye color. It's just not going to happen. God does not change those types of things. Hell, if he did, I would not look the way I do.

In fact, look at my many photos here: http://viewmorepics.myspace.com/ind...1&albumId=21098

Do you even realize countless times that I have been looked at as a terrorist because of my dark eyes, dark hair, tan skin, thick eyebrows and heavy facial hair? I am so sick and tired and even frustrated of looking the way I do only because it makes me paranoid towards certain situations. What if I get attacked or be assumed to be a terrorist. If God could truly change my looks, I would have asked to been blond-haired and blue-eyed because I know I would be more accepted by society. So because he can't do that, he also cannot change my sexuality. Understand now?

And this not meant to be off topic, if anything, it relates to the topic because Palin obviously believes that God can change our sexuality by the power of prayer and by providing such programs to do so. She is more than willing to allow us to be damaged. These programs are not safe and should not exist. They scare me, especially after reading the link I posted earlier.



Exactly my point!



Awww, thanks, but it is hard to accept and love myself at times. I still try, though.