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Mad Poster
Original Poster
#1 Old 14th Mar 2016 at 12:23 PM
Default A fix for "Met Self" memories -- bars on owned lots without University
I understand that Sims tending bars on owned lots can get "met self" memories which can lead to corruption and thus to the destruction of the whole 'hood. The usual fix for this is Pescado's dramafix, but I can't use that because I don't have (and possibly don't want) University. I tried that fix a couple of times, but, without University, it caused a jump bug every time a Sim met someone new.

Is there any alternative to dramafix that doesn't require University?

All Sims are beautiful -- even the ugly ones.
My Simblr ~~ My LJ
Sims' lives matter!
The Veronaville kids are alright.
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Mad Poster
#2 Old 14th Mar 2016 at 12:39 PM
If you don't find one, I made a suggestion in the other thread
The Great AntiJen
retired moderator
#3 Old 14th Mar 2016 at 2:57 PM
Can I just say (again) wonky memories in themselves are not and do not lead to corruption? They are a symptom of possible corruption in your hood but in themselves they are not corruption nor do they cause it. You can edit and delete memories at any point (in SimPE and with other tools) WITHOUT PROBLEM.

I no longer come over to MTS very often but if you would like to ask me a question then you can find me on tumblr or my own site tflc. TFLC has an archive of all my CC downloads.
I'm here on tumblr and my site, tflc
Mad Poster
Original Poster
#4 Old 15th Mar 2016 at 4:41 PM
Thanks Maxon!

That makes sense. A "met self" memory contains no invalid reference; both subject and object are a valid Sim - what makes it silly is that they're the same Sim. I can quite easily delete the "met self" memories myself, and if all that dramafix would do is stop them forming in the fir st place, then I'm maybe not much worse off without it. Does dramafix then only prevent the symptoms of corruption, and not the corruption itself? And, if there's no fix that prevents corruption, what's the risk if I just go ahead and play Malcolm Landgraab at Club Dante? (I presume there's a bar there. There are bars in most nightclubs!) I would continue my usual measures for safe play: frequent backups, frequent use of the HoodChecker, delete "met self" memories if I find any, and try to avoid other VBTs.

Since we're moving away from WCIF, maybe I should start a thread in the main board.

All Sims are beautiful -- even the ugly ones.
My Simblr ~~ My LJ
Sims' lives matter!
The Veronaville kids are alright.
The Great AntiJen
retired moderator
#5 Old 15th Mar 2016 at 4:58 PM
I thought dramafix (the Pescado mod) was to deal with the drama professors though maybe there's more to it. It's been so long since I looked at the Pescado hacks I have.

I no longer come over to MTS very often but if you would like to ask me a question then you can find me on tumblr or my own site tflc. TFLC has an archive of all my CC downloads.
I'm here on tumblr and my site, tflc
Mad Poster
Original Poster
#6 Old 15th Mar 2016 at 6:09 PM
As far as I can see, dramafix was written to deal with a number of issues associated with the drama professors, and one of those issues is that they evidently can cause "met self" memories. However (as I understand from esmeiolanthe and joandsarah77) bartending in bars on owned lots can also cause "met self" memories, and dramafix prevents these too. However I don't have University, and in my game it just causes a jump bug. Since the mod was primarily written for the drama professors, Pescado probably never tested it without University, even though it's not specified as a requirement in the RTFM.

I know I'm unusual in not having University, but I love playing perpetual teens, and I don't want their lives dominated by university wants.

All Sims are beautiful -- even the ugly ones.
My Simblr ~~ My LJ
Sims' lives matter!
The Veronaville kids are alright.
Scholar
#7 Old 16th Mar 2016 at 9:36 PM
Quote: Originally posted by maxon
Can I just say (again) wonky memories in themselves are not and do not lead to corruption? They are a symptom of possible corruption in your hood but in themselves they are not corruption nor do they cause it. You can edit and delete memories at any point (in SimPE and with other tools) WITHOUT PROBLEM.


Though I understand you're being helpful, and though it *is* also true that the OP makes a false assumption about it initially, I think that whether or not it is corruption, isn't really the point here, Maxon. It is annoying when the game creates nonsensical memories that it should not. I cannot see anything wrong with people requesting to learn of a way to work around the need to manually remove such crap on a regular basis. But what the dramafix has got to do with this, is somewhat vague to me as well. But maybe that because I'm not very comfortable with Pescado's mods in general...

I know that Mootilda's Hood Checker will help get rid of "met self" memories, but having to run that every few play sessions gets old in a hurry as well.
I was asked to consider making an edit of my No Trash Memories mod to fix this, but I don't think that will be very practical. I'm considering equiping No Sim Loaded with a special section that looks for the "met self" memory and kicks it in the brown star, though! It may take some doing, but I imagine that such a section could even be included in the most basic version of the mod... I'm prepared to investigate the possibility, at least, if anyone is interested in such a fix.
Mad Poster
#8 Old 16th Mar 2016 at 9:47 PM
BoilingOil to the rescue (One word, that name - to myself, retype!) - Thank you. Will you let us know when you have investigated, please?
Scholar
#9 Old 16th Mar 2016 at 10:26 PM
Sure, Justpetro. If I remember where this thread was again by the time it's ready, I'll report back
The Great AntiJen
retired moderator
#10 Old 16th Mar 2016 at 10:27 PM
Quote: Originally posted by BoilingOil
Though I understand you're being helpful, and though it *is* also true that the OP makes a false assumption about it initially, I think that whether or not it is corruption, isn't really the point here, Maxon. It is annoying when the game creates nonsensical memories that it should not. I cannot see anything wrong with people requesting to learn of a way to work around the need to manually remove such crap on a regular basis.

You seem to be making assumptions too about what I meant. My post was merely to reassure that problems with memories are not a game-breaking problem. I wasn't suggesting they do or not do anything. There is a history on this board of people saying that wonky memories mean corruption. I keep repeating that they're not because otherwise it seems to cause a lot of anxiety.

I no longer come over to MTS very often but if you would like to ask me a question then you can find me on tumblr or my own site tflc. TFLC has an archive of all my CC downloads.
I'm here on tumblr and my site, tflc
Scholar
#11 Old 16th Mar 2016 at 10:31 PM Last edited by BoilingOil : 17th Mar 2016 at 7:38 AM.
And that is not what I intended to imply either, friend.

(Edit to add: haha... the people disagreeing seem to imply that they know better what I did or did not mean to imply, than I do myself. I find that fascinating!!!)
Scholar
#12 Old 17th Mar 2016 at 7:32 AM Last edited by BoilingOil : 17th Mar 2016 at 8:21 AM.
Apologies for double-posting. I think the content of this post will excuse me, tho.

What I find odd, is that the dramafix would not work without Uni. As long as one owns and runs any later EP (in which category OFB also fits), there *should* really be no issue, unless Pes did one of his famous odd things...
But no matter that. I'm not in a position to blame anyone for anything. I'm here to try and help fix the problem! And I think I may have done just that.

One thing has become clear to me: whoever is using No Trash Memories, should not need any fix, because that one already keeps out ALL "Met anysim" memories, except the ones concerning Mystery Sim, if you have those excluded. And that mod can be used with ANY EP/SP combo, or even with BaseGame only. However, not everyone will want to use the NTM, and be looking for a less invasive alternative.

My earlier suggestion that I might include a fix in all versions of No Sim Loaded, doesn't seem to be that great, either, tho. All the existing NSL users would be required to get the new version, which would conflict with NTM as well. The conflict would be benign and NTM loads last, so there is no problem, but some people would still be alarmed by yet another conflict. Which I understand completely.

So I'm releasing a NEW stand-alone mod that keeps out only the "Met Self" memory. It will not delete existing "Met Self" memories, but it WILL prevent new ones from being created/added. To fix existing memories, I would suggest running Mootilda's Hood Checker once (if it handles memories, and not just the relationships. I do not remember that detail), or following Maxon's suggestion of manually destroying the memory in SimPE *after*installing the new mod, once it is online. I'll report back as soon as it is!

ETA: An alternative would be to use Pescado's FFS Lot Debugger to destroy boring memories, but that method is not recommended because it also kills some memories that might still be useful. Memory Commander, is another alternative, perhaps.
Needs Coffee
retired moderator
#13 Old 17th Mar 2016 at 7:41 AM
*puts up hand* I would be interested in such a mod! Especially if it could do drama proff met memory as well as the bar one because then I could remove drama fix and go back to having Proff with drama! Unlike most people (I guess) I actually enjoyed the forever in love, flirting drama proff. I hardly ever have sims take drama so that occasional drama was quite amusing. To me those should be in separate mods.

"I dream of a better tomorrow, where chickens can cross the road and not be questioned about their motives." - Unknown
~Call me Jo~
Scholar
#14 Old 17th Mar 2016 at 8:17 AM Last edited by BoilingOil : 17th Mar 2016 at 8:44 AM.
Oy, Jo. If the Drama Profs simply cause a "Met Self" memory on your sim, then they are automatically covered, because the program does not care how a memory was created. It merely looks for the memory's GUID and the IDs of owner and subject.

But if you're actually referring to memories of having met the Drama Profs, then we're suddenly in a whole new spooky forest, because nobody can say beforehand what the Neighbor or Person Instance IDs of the Drama Professors in any hood will be, so I would need to develop a routine to single them out, first. That's a lot more work than filtering out 'me'.

So in the first instance, you would be able to kill the Dramafix mod indeed, but in the second instance, I wouldn't count on it.

Edit to add: Anyway, it is done... Whoever desires to have a fix for the "Met Self" memory, can now go get BO - No Met Self Memories.

Enjoy!
Mad Poster
Original Poster
#15 Old 17th Mar 2016 at 2:23 PM
I was going to post to thank everyone for their concern, and to ask maxon and BoilingOil to, please, not fall out on my account, because I really do appreciate both of your concern. And yes, you have both helped me. And I was going to just go ahead and play the lots with owned bars, and rely on HoodChecker (which I run at least once a month anyway) and manual checking to remove any "met self" memories.

But now BoilingOil, who I think is one of the top modders in the game today, has specially written a mod to fix my problem. What can I say? Thank you! Thank you! Thank you! Thank you!

I really am a very eccentric Simmer (with some very eccentric Sims :lovestruc ). I don't use No Trash Memories or the Delete Trash Memories option on the batbox, because I love all those trivial memories, including the "met Sim" memories. On my very first visit to a Maxis community lot back in December 2012, I got Julian Moltke (who had gone to Veronaville Market with his mum and little sister) to check out a couple of teenage townie boys that he met thee, because I wanted him to be gay. Three years later Julian can still remember meeting those boys (both of whom are now playable), and so can I. I am very reluctant to delete my Sims' valid memories, because I think that in many ways it's our memories that make us who we are, and I think of my Sims as essentially sentient beings very like myself. I can remember lots of trivial things in my life, and like my Sims to have similar memories.

I sometimes wonder if, as maxon says, wonky memories are just (at worst) a symptom of corruption and not a cause, do we really need to remove any valid memories at all? Including gossip memories? I do occasionally delete all gossip with the batbox, but a bit reluctantly, because I like to occasionally look at my Sims memories in SimPE and see what they've been talking about. Most Sims gossip is, let's face it, boring, but now and then I've picked up something quite juicy by looking at the gossip in SimPE. It's how I learned that townie Ralph Enriquez had had his first kiss (autonomously deciding that he was gay -- quite remarkable in an ACR-free game). In fact I only use the original basic version of No Sim Loaded -- because I actually like attraction markers. I find it interesting to see (in SimPE) who my Sims have been attracted to. (I know that should be "to whom my Sims have been attracted", but that's too pedantic, even for me! ) So maybe, BoilingOil, as the author of No Sim Loaded, you may want to persuade me why I ought to remove attraction markers.

About dramafix not working without University, you may, BoilingOil, in another thread have pointed out the cause of my problem. I know a lot of users with the higher EPs have to delete their cache files frequently, or the game won't load. My highest EP is OFB, and my game always loads, so I've rarely, if ever, deleted my cache files. I didn't know that I should also delete them when adding new mods (or new versions of old mods). There are some other commonly used hacks, like Pescado's Phone Hack and Syberspunk's Adults Go Steady that don't work for me. So maybe I should try them again with my cache files deleted.

Anyway, thanks again for writing that fix for me -- that's well beyond the call of duty!

All Sims are beautiful -- even the ugly ones.
My Simblr ~~ My LJ
Sims' lives matter!
The Veronaville kids are alright.
Mad Poster
#16 Old 17th Mar 2016 at 3:20 PM
Dramafixes description says:

Prevents creation of drama professor "lost best friend" visible and invisible memory spam and "met self" memories.

So I guess it is still required for those of us who do have University.
Scholar
#17 Old 17th Mar 2016 at 3:24 PM
Don't you worry about us falling out, AndrewGloria. Maxon and I are both mature and responsible enough to prevent a real falling out from occurring.

And I understand *and* respect your reasons for wanting to keep memories and markers as much as possible. There are more people who play that way. Heck, I could have made a single mod that combine all the powers of the most advanced NSL and NTM. But I specifically did NOT do that, *because* I respect that different players have different tastes, and therefor want different things from their game. And in quite a few of my mods, there are even options for players to adjust settings to their own preference. I like to be able to please a lot of people. I want my mods to be accessible to a wide audience. So there!

And you *ought* to do nothing! With OFB as your latest expansion and no University, your game does not use as much space as that of many others. At best, each main hood in your game has two subhoods: Downtown and Bluewater Village. That means that there are far fewer sims than in my game that has all the EPs and SPs, fewer lots to go to, and as a result less opportunities for the game to screw stuff up. Your game could still run on an older computer without taking two or three hours to load. So you don't very strictly *need* to destroy memories, gossip, markers and all that stuff. For me and many other who have the complete set - and especially those that could not afford to buy a more modern system - the situation is much different.

I know of people who start their computer as soon as they get out of bed, and start their Sims game. Then they run the coffee maker, prepare and eat breakfast, take a shower, make their beds, do some or all of their chores, read the newspaper, and then by the time everything is done, three hours later, their game is finally almost ready to play! If their system hangs because there is too much crud in memory, they've lost three hours and must start all over again! In *that* case it's useful to have ways to minimize the amount of tokens, markers, controllers, memories, and yes, gossip! But for you, that is not as relevant! So as long as your system is fine with all the memories that you leave intact, so much more power to you!! Keep it like that as long as you can!

Only the thing about the cache files. When replacing/upgrading mods, it is indeed recommended to always at *least* delete the "groups.cache" file. "accessory.cache" is much less of an issue, really, and can probably just be ignored most of the time. But deleting "groups.cache" is *also* important when you *delete* mods, and much less when you *add* stuff. But many people make a habit of destroying the cache files after EVERY play session. It doesn't hurt their game at all. In fact, most of these people have far less issues than the ones that never delete those files.

Also, it was *my* pleasure to make this mod for you. Next to simming, I like solving such coding puzzles. I had real fun doing this.
The Great AntiJen
retired moderator
#18 Old 17th Mar 2016 at 8:52 PM Last edited by maxon : 17th Mar 2016 at 10:33 PM.
Quote: Originally posted by AndrewGloria
I was going to post to thank everyone for their concern, and to ask maxon and BoilingOil to, please, not fall out on my account, because I really do appreciate both of your concern. And yes, you have both helped me. And I was going to just go ahead and play the lots with owned bars, and rely on HoodChecker (which I run at least once a month anyway) and manual checking to remove any "met self" memories.

Hey don't worry about that. Me and BO were just grumping at each other. We're both big and old enough to cope with that. BO's a great modder and I appreciate him visiting over here. [aaaand Ninja'd]

Quote: Originally posted by AndrewGloria
I sometimes wonder if, as maxon says, wonky memories are just (at worst) a symptom of corruption and not a cause, do we really need to remove any valid memories at all? Including gossip memories? I do occasionally delete all gossip with the batbox, but a bit reluctantly, because I like to occasionally look at my Sims memories in SimPE and see what they've been talking about. Most Sims gossip is, let's face it, boring, but now and then I've picked up something quite juicy by looking at the gossip in SimPE. It's how I learned that townie Ralph Enriquez had had his first kiss (autonomously deciding that he was gay -- quite remarkable in an ACR-free game). In fact I only use the original basic version of No Sim Loaded -- because I actually like attraction markers. I find it interesting to see (in SimPE) who my Sims have been attracted to. (I know that should be "to whom my Sims have been attracted", but that's too pedantic, even for me! ) So maybe, BoilingOil, as the author of No Sim Loaded, you may want to persuade me why I ought to remove attraction markers.

No you don't need to remove memories though it does clean things up a bit and they are rather prone to getting themselves mixed up. And I agree with you about liking some of the memories and keeping track of what's going on. It's why I do it all by hand. But that's not an option for everyone (though it does explain why I know a lot about memories and memory editing).

I no longer come over to MTS very often but if you would like to ask me a question then you can find me on tumblr or my own site tflc. TFLC has an archive of all my CC downloads.
I'm here on tumblr and my site, tflc
Scholar
#19 Old 18th Mar 2016 at 1:03 AM
See, AndrewGloria? In the end, Maxon and I are in complete agreement, mostly :p
Needs Coffee
retired moderator
#20 Old 18th Mar 2016 at 1:46 AM
Quote: Originally posted by BoilingOil
I know of people who start their computer as soon as they get out of bed, and start their Sims game. Then they run the coffee maker, prepare and eat breakfast, take a shower, make their beds, do some or all of their chores, read the newspaper, and then by the time everything is done, three hours later, their game is finally almost ready to play!


Hey! Are you spying on me BO?! That is pretty correct, although my old game 'only' took an hour! My new game now takes about 15 which i can live with, it's normally done by the time I have cleaned my kitchen. If it loaded in a minute when would I clean?

"I dream of a better tomorrow, where chickens can cross the road and not be questioned about their motives." - Unknown
~Call me Jo~
Scholar
#21 Old 18th Mar 2016 at 5:57 AM
If it would load in just a minute, you would do everything BEFORE turning on your PC, Jo. That's how it *should* go, it least. Although I must admit that for me, it doesn't work that way. :D
Mad Poster
#22 Old 18th Mar 2016 at 6:27 AM
Yeah, it doesn't work that way. Slow loading forces you to do the chores while you're waiting. If it loads fast then it becomes ... I'll just check in on this family and then I'll do X chore ... is it really midnight, well I guess I'll do that chore tomorrow (spoiler: it won't be done tomorrow either). XD
Mad Poster
#23 Old 18th Mar 2016 at 11:50 AM
I need to get my game to load slower. A lot slower. Let me go and put the dishes in the trash can quickly.... and think about my Sims' memories while I am doing it.
Scholar
#24 Old 18th Mar 2016 at 12:58 PM
Quote: Originally posted by Charity
Yeah, it doesn't work that way.


That's what she said!

I have the same issue: once I start my game, it's hard to shut it down and do the much less important RL stuff that needs to be done.
Instructor
#25 Old 19th Mar 2016 at 1:14 AM
@Charity - loved your comment. That is so me. I have had to start using a timer to make myself stop and do a chore. It even works once in a while. LOL

I've had the Met Self problem often. Or rather my sims have. Recently one of my sim ladies met a gentleman she already knew at a party. A 3 bolt gentleman. They spent the evening becoming better acquainted, became best friends, fell in love and wound up in bed. Next day I was checking her memories and found that she became best friends with herself, fell in love with herself and woohooed with herself. Her memories of other boyfriends were all normal. Does anyone know what Causes that?
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